Suppressive Fire as of .95, does it work?

[Cavazos]

What is your opinion on the effectiveness of using "suppressive fire"? This is mostly aimed at infantry suppression with an LMG and M16, but suppression can come from HMGs mounted on a vehicle or from tanks.

Is it only effective when vehicles use it?

If there are two infantry moving together, should one attempt to suppress a target at 25m while the other takes aim? What about 100m?

In my opinion, if there is a full squad of 6 troops with M16s and a M249, I think you need 4 members firing to effectively suppress an enemy at least while two assault and flank.

[goguapsy]

I am a defender of bigger and meaner suppression effects. They are annoying SOMETIMES... But I feel it is not effective, almost at all. I would suggest that suppression effects affected a larger area, with, say, a big distance having some blur, a medium distance having the current suppression effect, and a close distance an overwhelming, black and red, bleed noise effects, to REALLY distract the player and prevent him from returning fire (close suppressive fire = black + wound effects (sound + blood) = don't know if you were hit, gotta withdraw to safer position).

[L4gi]

Afaik suppression only works when the rounds are fired from further than 60 or 70 meters from the target. At distances below that, you should be able to kill the guy anyway.

[dtacs]

The concept of 'suppression' in PR is irrelevant as there is no fear of death, people disregard themselves by running around corners spraying hoping to get a kill, disbarring realism totally as they know they will be able to do the same thing within minutes. This is in addition to the absolute spontaneity and randomness which plagues infantry engagements.

This translates to snipers often popping up to take a shot even though they could have the whole team firing at them, it makes little difference. I find myself popping up to shoot even if a tank is facing me, and I see others do the same in a role-reversal.

As for the physical suppression effect itself, its as good as its going to get. Until the developers find a way to make players be more content and actually reserve themselves instead of popping out into a hail of bullets we are going to continue to see people do stupid things in order to get kills.

[Nebsif]

^ Medic kit, as much as it is the core of PR makes squads disregard their lives too..
But uhm ye, ive learned that (mostly from l4gi ) the less ur afraid to die the more u'll pwn.. be it rushing straight into an enem sq through grenade spam or firing back at inf supported by APC/tank as long as u have "good" cover.
When ppl start suppressive fire on me I see it more of a sign of fear so I just fire back.

[Web_cole]

In my opinion, if there is a full squad of 6 troops with M16s and a M249, I think you need 4 members firing to effectively suppress an enemy at least while two assault and flank.

If you really want to do the whole "support fireteam" + "assault fireteam" thing, then tbh all you really need to suppress (= kill shit) with is the SAW. Maybe leave 1 guy to watch his back or a DM for increased accurate fire, but I would say you certainly want more than 2 people in your assault section.

[L4gi]

the less ur afraid to die the more u'll pwn

Most people doubt their own skills more than they should. Too many players are afraid to take any kind of risks. By using common sense, you can come to the conclusion that doing something will result in a better outcome than not doing anything.

Example:

You sit behind a wall, your squad is close, but cant support you. You know theres a few enemies on the other side. They know you're there. If you dont do anything, they will either frag you or rush you, both resulting in you getting shot. If you take the initiative, throw a frag/incendiary, assault them or whatever, there is a chance that you will take them out, and there is a chance you will take em out.

Option 2 sounds a lot better than just getting shot. Even if you do get shot, you most likely killed atleast 1 enemy, which causes them to slow down and start the process of reviving. By this time your squad is there, they can move in, shoot everyone and revive you.(Or you killed the enemies already )

People in defensive positions will ALWAYS, and I mean always killed/overrun/whatever. Might take some time, but eventually they will die. There is no 100% unbeatable defensive position. The best defence is killin the shit out of the enemy while they stack up on a corner thinking about who is watching which angle and who is going to throw their grenade. In the end, the game is about speed and being confident in yourself. The more time you waste in setting up fireteams, supporting elements and stuff like that, the more time it gives me to shoot you in the face.

A bit offtopic and perhaps a wall of text, but I know what im talking about.

[MaxBooZe]

All the shots you take should be aimed to kill. The suppression effect is a nice bonus.

[Arc_Shielder]

People in defensive positions will ALWAYS, and I mean always killed/overrun/whatever.

I was about to post how collectively that isn't the case, but then you posted an individualistic scenario and I have to go along with you.

Many times I just hide and shoot the enemy in the face and then burst in. Other times hoping that they think I ran away and ambush them a few minutes later. Even hide and seek can be incredibly funny and effective, especially if you have the medic role. Don't necessarily have to be suicidal though...unless when you're heavily bleeding. By then you can say "screw it" and charge the over-prepared assaulting enemy team.

Important thing is never to stay still if you're alone and sighted. And this works too if you're running mortars, repelled as an offensive squad, hunting armor, sniping, etc. Never stay in the same place if your enemy sighted you, just use common sense and change your strategy.

As for supressive fire is fine the way it is. The only times I ever feel slightly intimidated is through AR or armor fire. Sometimes when I see mortar rounds on a certain objective or cache between the team's frontline and the enemy, I just run through them and take a few enemies out. It's all about anticipating the enemy and there's nothing arrogant and presumptuous about these claims...most this stuff is just common sense. Like L4gi very well stated, anyone can overcome the typical gaming reactions.

[TheComedian]

In the end, the game is about speed and being confident in yourself.

I thought this was Project Reality and not Modern Warfare

[sweedensniiperr]

I thought this was Project Reality and not Modern Warfare

The people who can't see risks or dangers are stupid or really really confident, however armies love these people since they don't mind the risks and will get the job done better.

And yes, speed is obviously a key everytime military is involved.

[L4gi]

I thought this was Project Reality and not Modern Warfare

Just cause you dont know what youre doing doesnt mean I dont.

[Rudd]

In the end, the game is about speed and being confident in yourself

I'd say its a mixture, holding a advantageous static position is my default action; however I try to recognise oppotunities to exploit, and when that happens I want it to be fast and merciless.

No one tactic is good for everything, e.g. rushers generally gain rewards on public servers, however I've seen it turned against them as they too can be ambushed trying to rush or ambush certain positions.

Supressive fire in .95 works, but its quite hard to do, a vehicle is better at it due to the large supply of coax ammo it carries. When you do use suppresive fire you gotta try and ensure YOU are attackable only from a specific sector. If you don't then your exposed suppressing tactic will end with your death from a direction you couldn't watch. This can usually be achieved quite easily, e.g. just step back in to the room that contains the window you're using. The wider your field of view, the more exposed you are.

However suppressive fire is only one component of what you require to win a firefight.

A suppressed enemy only has to step back in to cover to be safe, and you will be expending alot of ammo keeping him there, You require an attacking element, be it from your squad or another, air, mortars, more infantry etc.

I feel that 128 players will increase the necessity of such tactics, which will be great

[Drav]

Absolute rubbish L4gi, thats just the way you play, which happens to work for you! Ofc defence can be totally impenetrable, to say that endless charging is the way forward is just not true, Ive seen waves and waves of squads die in front of a decent defence, you just have to actually do it!!

[Smegburt_funkledink]

Ofc defence can be totally impenetrable

Whilst I'd like to agree, I think that's debatable. Everything has some kind of counter. Since Mortars and Thermals have been in PR, the goalposts have moved way too much.

For a defence to be 100% impenetrable, at times, it requires an offence of sorts I believe. But that's a whole different discussion.

[Tiger1]

You setup a defensive position until reinforcements arrive. Hopefully they will arrive. If not, God Speed.

Or you fight till the bitter end.

[Wifout Teef]

So I just got PR last week, so I don't have as much experience as you guys.

But I can confirm that suppressive fire is extremely useful. I have used it several times each game I have played.

For example:

I was playing operation archer as a canadian automatic rifleman. Countless times throughout the match I would suppress taliban infantry. At the bunker area, my squad and I were positioned on a hill a few hundred meters away. I got like 6 kills there by hitting infantry in the open and I successfully suppressed them when they were hiding in the bunkers and control tower. Also I used it a lot while attacking the castle. I used both my LMG and a mounted .50 cal to suppress snipers in the castle.

Now I can't really confirm if they were hiding because of the suppression blurring effect or they just didn't want to die.

But when I'm pinned down by enemy suppressive fire, I experience the blur enough to stop myself from returning fire effectively unless I'm extremely determined. But like many players in PR, I simply don't want to die because it's a pain. So I hightail it out of there.

[Rudd]

You setup a defensive position until reinforcements arrive. Hopefully they will arrive. If not, God Speed.

Or you fight till the bitter end.

I prefer setting up a defensive position that the enemy have to attack by leaving their defensive flag area.

once this is accomplished, pin them in place while flanking elements take their flag from behind them, then run like hell to avoid dying over ground that has no more value to you.

[goguapsy]

The concept of 'suppression' in PR is irrelevant as there is no fear of death,

I do think that adding harsher suppressive effects - say, if you are getting suppressed and bullets are CLOSE (ie. as you get suppressed currently), the screen should go really black and red (as if you got hit), so you try to fall back to a safer spot to get healed "if you actually got shot" or just figure that you almost got shot. Either way, you would fall back, because you would think you got hit and couldn't see squat.

Medium and long hits should suppress how it is at the moment for close ranges.

[Cavazos]

Perhaps when thinking of suppression, think of it requiring a combined arms approach to really do anything, and not aiming to suppress but aiming to actually kill them.

If you have an American infantry squad, maybe to have "effective suppression" you would need an M249 Squad Assault Weapon (SAW) for a heavy volume of fire that is accurate, with a M203 Grenade Launcher (GL) to hit targets in cover, and a M14 Squad Designated Marksman (SDM) to give precise fire when you can see the enemy, all this just to do what might be good suppression.

Your are indeed aiming to kill, not suppress. Suppression would just the next best thing. What effective suppression might be is almost killing them, or really trying to kill them but can't.