Infantry weapon damage changes

[Brozef]

Don't know if this was mentioned but the Shotgun takes about 8 shots to kill a crate shooting at the wooden base. That sucks *** please reverse it.

[Heavy Death]

People, git gud.

No really, why not adjust own gameplay to match the changes. And the bitching about snipers, dear god.

I agree that shotguns need revision, if anything the crate/door damage and point blank stuff.

But I have a solution to atleast get a more "fair" gap for the time being! Change the bleed effect to represent pain, not only bleeding and thus raise the starting point to after second shot with a 9mm on armor!
This way, any weapon does damage in an "annoying" way. Sure, close quarters G3 vs 9mm both with armor is a no brainer, but that godlike MG3 mother would take a 5.56 into the shoulder and be rendered way less effective.

Buff the bleed screen effect, make it start on second armored 9mm shot, reduce the bleed per second ammount by 35%. GG, EZ, after you do that, you have time to polish and do advanced stuff.

Kkthxbb.

[inb4banned]

People, git gud.

No really, why not adjust own gameplay to match the changes. And the bitching about snipers, dear god.

I agree that shotguns need revision, if anything the crate/door damage and point blank stuff.

But I have a solution to atleast get a more "fair" gap for the time being! Change the bleed effect to represent pain, not only bleeding and thus raise the starting point to after second shot with a 9mm on armor!
This way, any weapon does damage in an "annoying" way. Sure, close quarters G3 vs 9mm both with armor is a no brainer, but that godlike MG3 mother would take a 5.56 into the shoulder and be rendered way less effective.

Buff the bleed screen effect, make it start on second armored 9mm shot, reduce the bleed per second ammount by 35%. GG, EZ, after you do that, you have time to polish and do advanced stuff.

Kkthxbb.

You start bleeding when your health is below 80%, you're bleeding after 2nd 9mm shot already, same if you take 5.56 into the arm, even beyond 300m. Your suggestions solve nothing, only overcomplicate a simple issue.

[DogACTUAL]

It would be nice if there was a way to model hitboxes for all inner organs, major nerves and blood vessels.
Then we could have the best balance.

[Aleon]

Simply said, there was never a reason to take 7.62 over 5.56.

You keep bringing this up FFG, but this is a non-argument. We can agree on the premise that 7.62 is better than 5.56 on the current patch, I hope. Now please list the factions where you have the ability to choose between the two.

... Insurgents, and some factions marksmen or MG kits? Am I missing someone?

Broadly speaking your use of one or the other is forced by your faction. You don't get to pick between the two. "There is a reason to pick 7.62" translates to "you are at an advantage if your faction uses 7.62". It's not a choice. If you are MEC, everyone gets 7.62. If you are not, pretty much no one does. And as we all seem to agree that one is clearly superior to the other, it's quite easy to see that there is a balance issue here.

(And before you start with the "but before", G3s were completely viable before. Good damage, 1-tap people with head shots, and stronger than any alternative at long range. Obviously not the best gun in cqb, but we don't want all guns to be the same do we? And if you disagree on this, and your point is that we needed to buff 7.62, that could be done without completely wrecking everything else in the game. )

[fecht_niko]

To sum up that "fix":

positive: bullets loose damage on long range, 7.62 guns are used more often

negative: 1-shot ability, full shotgun mag to destroy a crate or open a door, SMGs need full mag to kill someone, some snipers need 2 hits

GAMEBREAKING: 7.62 vs no bodyarmor (INS, Vietnam broken), shotguns & pistols useless.

That means you broke SO much stuff to make 7.62 better.
People complained about AR15 weapons being OP because of their ROF, why didnt you just nerf their damage a bit?

[DogACTUAL]

It would be nice to do a poll to see what most people actually think about the new system.
Because i think if you only go by comments you don't get an accurate representation of the real public consensus.

I would say multiple polls:

1. How do you like the new system overall?

2. How do you like the new battle rifle/assault rifle stats?

3. How do you like the new pistol/shotgun/SMG stats?

Please do it, i think it would be really helpful.

[camo]

https://www.realitymod.com/forum/f604-p ... gelog.html

To save you some time.
Old

New

[DogACTUAL]

Really nice!

I would say shotguns could still use a bit more punch at at 10m and 50m, but it it's not a big deal imo.

Pistols against unarmored might be even considered a bit too op now, haha.
It really contrasts well with their performance against armour, so i look forward to people playing smarter and trying to aim for unarmored body parts when using pistols and other close range weapons.
Finally body armour plays a relevant role and you will notice it in most cases now.

Good that you are keeping the unified cartridge performance across different weapons.

Really nice edits overall!

[Allahu Akbar]

There should be a drastic decrease in damage past 100m or 150mm for 5.56x45; should be to the point where 5.45x39 surpasses it at 150m or 200m(depending on barrel length).
Angry Peasants: Effective Range of Your 223 or 5.56 Rifle
Kind of bullshit for 5.56 to do over 50% more damage than 5.45 at 600m.

Also, 7.62x39 shouldn't be doing that much damage to flesh even assuming it's M67.
http://i1260.photobucket.com/albums/...ps1d0e445c.jpg

This new damage is also a straight up nerf to insurgent bolt action rifles, they already have no scope but now they can't one-shot-kill to the leg even point blank.

Also, "full damage chart" is missing many different bullets, such as 5.8 ones, .45, and .303 british.

[inb4banned]

As long as automatic rifles can 1 shot while SMGs take 6 shots to kill this system is not worth having. Why not address the many good posts in the feedback thread, let us know what you wised to accomplish.

It's another broken system that is allowed to stay in because it's not less broken than before.

[X-Alt]

As long as automatic rifles can 1 shot while SMGs take 6 shots to kill this system is not worth having. Why not address the many good posts in the feedback thread, let us know what you wised to accomplish.

It's another broken system that is allowed to stay in because it's not less broken than before.

Body armor is designed to counter pistol caliber weapons.


Congratulations, use another gun.

[DogACTUAL]

The system right now is pretty much almost perfect, no major complaints now from my perspective.

To people complaining about 1 shot full auto rifles against unarmored targets (at medium range):

-before the new system it was 7.62 2 shot/5.56 3 shot

-now the new system is 7.62 one shot/5.56 2 shot

Notice anything?

[inb4banned]

The system right now is pretty much almost perfect, no major complaints now from my perspective.

To people complaining about 1 shot full auto rifles against unarmored targets (at medium range):

-before the new system it was 7.62 2 shot/5.56 3 shot

-now the new system is 7.62 one shot/5.56 2 shot

Notice anything?

Yes, it was easy before and it's even easier now, bad gameplay.

[DogACTUAL]

if you go test it yourself...

You are kidding, right? You pulled that quote from a post i made before they released the second iteration of the weapons update! Again, that post you quoted was referring to the first iteration of the weapons update.

Check out the chart of that particular update and you will see that shotguns were not a one hit at close range!
Look at my newest posts, i am actually thanking the DEVs that they buffed the shotguns to a one hit at close range!

[FlyingR]

A problem that I might see to this is that people with high ping will have a much harder time.

With low caliber weapons (especially pistols and smgs) we will have to shoot even more (waste more ammo) and we will die much more because of the low "reaction time", especially against the 1 shot bullets.

[DogACTUAL]

After some more gameplay and testing i think shotguns could still use more power at close and medium range (0-50m). Pistols and SMGs should also be more powerful at medium range (50-150m).

Anyone else got the same impressions?

[Fracsid]

Crossposting this from the 1.4.9 changelog because it seems like a more proper place and I want it to be seen;

Would it be possible to implement a pseudorandom damage range for each caliber and hit box to attempt to recreate some of the uncertainties of real life like angle of the impact, different organs, acts of god, etc? Would this be possible in the engine, and would it be possible without creating too much CPU load? It could be made so that the battle rifles don't ALWAYS kill in a single unarmored torso shot (damage range between 90 and the current 130), but stand a good chance of doing so. This would simultaneously mitigate gameplay concerns people have and increase realism. Depending on how detailed one wanted to make a random damage system (adding statistical weights to certain values or ranges), they could even simulate hard armor plates catastrophically failing or not covering the area the bullet impacts on rare occasions for torso shots.

I also think the fact that M855 ball relies on fragmentation as its wounding mechanism and won't reliably fragment below a certain velocity threshold should be taken into account in its damage past (roughly, and depending on barrel length) 200m. This is another reason damage ranges rather than static damage are a much better model, to simulate the uncertainty of M855 fragmentation. M193 ball, which would be used on Vietnam maps, has a lower fragmentation velocity threshold, and therefore fragments at longer ranges.

In my opinion, once it gets decently below that fragmentation velocity threshold it should behave very closely to 5.45, which uses yaw and cavitation as its wounding mechanism. The 5.45 projectiles are also thinner and longer, and therefore have a higher ballistic coefficient, meaning more conserved energy at range than the M855 ball. Essentially, the 5.45 would eventually overtake the 5.56 in damage at range, and also have less drop.

Edit:

The extremity (arms, lower legs) damage values seem pretty excessively high. In my opinion, pistol and intermediate caliber damage to that area should only require a field dressing to treat. Full power .30 cal and .338 should require a medic but not kill in two shots to that area. There should be a much higher drop off between damage to the vital zones of the head and torso and damage to extremities, rewarding superior shot placement.

[Heavy Death]

Few shots in the arm renders you unable to fight, so critically wounded is a sensible option.