Project Reality Forums

[R-CON]Mats391 wrote:I dont think it would that great. I mean the idea of kicking in doors is great, but with the current gameplay where you can only open doors with shotguns it is a bit missleading. Why can the russian breacher punch open a door, but others cant? That kind of stuff.

Because superior Russian will!!



But yeah i agree

[R-CON]Mats391 wrote:I dont think it would that great. I mean the idea of kicking in doors is great, but with the current gameplay where you can only open doors with shotguns it is a bit missleading. Why can the russian breacher punch open a door, but others cant? That kind of stuff.

Because Russia Stronk.

УРА!!


Personally, I have never felt like the RU Breacher was at any noticeable disadvantage on any RU maps. And I enjoy playing as the RU Breacher quite a lot, so I am not just saying this as some US Marine shooting him from far away.

The inability to break open doors/gates would only be a hindrance if somebody made some kind of RU CQB map where opening doors/gates is a necessity (Fallujah or Kokan, for example, are such maps). And even if such a map was finished and put into PR, it would be a simple fix to just give the breacher more C4 sticks to use.

Alternatively (also a lot less practical), implement a 7.62x39 rifle (AK-103?) as an ALT weapon for the Breacher, so he can just shoot all the locks open.

I disagree with the notion that the RU breacher does not need a shotgun. He does need it, he deserves it.

1. I'd rather not waste a c4 charge to blow a gate, when a single shotgun blast would do.

2. I want to see an Insurgents VS Russian map some day and the breacher will need a shotgun to arrest civis.

3. On some maps when facing off against a team that uses shotguns I feel at a disadvantage.

4. A shotgun is a gun and it's like having two primary weapons and that makes breacher one of the most popular classes. Except for RU breacher, fuck him he's the poor kid that can only afford an AK.

5. If you cannot give RU breacher a shotgun for realism reasons than give him something that has the utility of the shotgun and that would be more realistic.

If someone get butthurt from Saiga, R-Devs always can replaced semi auto shotgun for something pump action. Like MP-133

Why do developers decided that russian army doesnt uses shotguns at all?
Russian Ministry of Internal Affairs have adopted "18.5 KC-K" (12 gauge saiga version with picatinny rail) in 2006, and since it have seen action in counter-terrorist activities in caucasus regions. Weapon is seen in use with many different configurations (flashlights, optics, muzzle brakes, grips, etc).

The structure of the Russian army is closely connected with the special forces of the Ministry of Internal Affairs in caucasus regions, it is basicaly the same units, so it safe to say that this patricular shotgun is in use in russian army, should they need a "breacher".

http://www.arms-expo.ru/armament/samples/1313/81242/

Isn't the easiest solution the addition of a third C4 and be done with it? Chances that you open more than a door per life are small anyway.

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Give russian breacher a sledgehammer to open doors, destroy crates and rek shit in melee. Shouldn't be hard to make and would be damn cool.

VTRaptor wrote: Give russian breacher a sledgehammer to open doors, destroy crates and rek shit in melee. Shouldn't be hard to make and would be damn cool.

That's quite interesting idea, i like it
Inb4 r6 parallels.

[R-DEV]rPoXoTauJIo wrote:That's quite interesting idea, i like it
Inb4 r6 parallels.

LMG MOUNTED! AND LOADED!

agus92 wrote:Isn't the easiest solution the addition of a third C4 and be done with it? Chances that you open more than a door per life are small anyway.

Actually, shotguns can be used in Close Quarter Combat instead of the AR and, guess what, they're pretty damn effective.

Tajulek wrote:Actually, shotguns can be used in Close Quarter Combat instead of the AR and, guess what, they're pretty damn effective.

Guess what, I already knew. But devs don't want to give a shotgun for realism purposes, as stated multiple times, so your solution does not satisfy the constraints of the problem. Mine does.

In the beginning, only special forces were used shotgun.
Then the United States attacked Iraq, Afghanistan.. and there was a need to clean the terrain.Because of that they put breacher in regular army units.
Now we have to wait for Russia to attack somebody with land units,and then she will put breacher(with shotgun) in regular army units.This is reality.

But MEC forces with shotgun,someone is playing with reality.Maybe the Iranian Revolutionary Guard owns it.For every country that has expeditionary forces, of course, it has breacher.In reality, neither the Polish army has a shotgun in regular army.

lakinen wrote:In the beginning, only special forces were used shotgun.
Then the United States attacked Iraq, Afghanistan.. and there was a need to clean the terrain.Because of that they put breacher in regular army units.
Now we have to wait for Russia to attack somebody with land units,and then she will put breacher(with shotgun) in regular army units.This is reality.

But MEC forces with shotgun,someone is playing with reality.Maybe the Iranian Revolutionary Guard owns it.For every country that has expeditionary forces, of course, it has breacher. In reality, neither the Polish army has a shotgun in regular army.

OK.... source??

lakinen wrote:In the beginning, only special forces were used shotgun.
Then the United States attacked Iraq, Afghanistan.. and there was a need to clean the terrain.Because of that they put breacher in regular army units.
Now we have to wait for Russia to attack somebody with land units,and then she will put breacher(with shotgun) in regular army units.This is reality.

Dunno what "beginning" you're talking about but shotguns have been in considerable use by the US Armed Forces since WWI and were also issued regularly to Army and especially Marine units. The US then entered WWII and shotguns were used but more commonly seen with the Marines during their Island hopping campaign in the Pacific.
Shotguns even saw extensive use during the Vietnam war where there were up to two shotgun specialists present in the squad at a time.


Now to the 21st century which is where the majority of PR takes place you already see the M590 and the M1014. Shotguns worked for us for decades so it stayed. Breachers/weapons specialists have always existed prior not just because we invaded Iraq and Afghanistan.
Compared to the US and other countries it seems that Russia has not had the time for or pretty much cared for a shotgun to be used by anyone other than Interior Police or Special Forces units.

lakinen wrote:But MEC forces with shotgun,someone is playing with reality.Maybe the Iranian Revolutionary Guard owns it.For every country that has expeditionary forces, of course, it has breacher.In reality, neither the Polish army has a shotgun in regular army.

MEC is a fictional faction/nation to begin with so I feel like there can be more leeway to what equipment the faction receives. According to the BF2 wiki MEC consists of countries like Kuwait and Qatar so that oil money could theoretically be used to procure Saiga-12s and Eryxs. Also Poland does use a shotgun (M590)within its regular units but from what I've read its only been in limited issue to Polish troops who are supposed to deploy to the Middle East or Western Africa.

So, every military that are in active duty against insurgent-alike enemy adopts shotgun for obvious reasons.
There are military factions in PR that in real world doesnt use shotguns regulary/only use it among special forces and their breacher HAVE shotgun in the game.
... but russians dont have. Just because it is "realism".
Although realisticaly they would adopt shotgun quckly if they engaged in a war that reqiures it. But they dont have shotgun in pr.
BECAUSE REALISM!!!

Unacceptable wrote:... but russians dont have. Just because it is "realism".

It's... Unacceptable

But for real, I think that DEVs should look into adding a shotgun for the russian forces, simply for the balance purposes.

Tajulek wrote:It's... Unacceptable

But for real, I think that DEVs should look into adding a shotgun for the russian forces, simply for the balance purposes.

How exactly would giving RU forces a shotgun for their breacher class balance any aspect? RU forces have been holding their own against other factions even without a shotgun. A shotgun is not likely to change the outcome of a game compared to the performance of the team itself.

AFAIK there are few or probably no Russian INS maps that allow the restraint of civies nor are there many doors you would need to shoot down compared to Fallujah or Al Basrah.

Just give the Russian breacher more C4s and grenades to deal with doors and crates if you're so worried about "balance purposes"

BubblyNinja wrote:A shotgun is not likely to change the outcome of a game compared to the performance of the team itself.

How is this a counterargument? xD If it doesn't affect an outcome and it does narrow the playstyle, then why don't add it?

BubblyNinja wrote:AFAIK there are few or probably no Russian INS maps that allow the restraint of civies nor are there many doors you would need to shoot down compared to Fallujah or Al Basrah.

Again - a shotgun is used not only for the purposes you mentioned here

Has anyone mentioned the Military Adviser(s) for the Russian Armed Forces? I believe that at one point there were veterans/active duty soldiers who were able to inform the Developers on which pieces of kit are currently being fielded by said Army. There was a time when Russians had a shotgun on their breacher but it was deemed unrealistic due to the Chinese manufactured model used and the fact that that the Russians never fully employed Shotguns.

https://www.realitymod.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1585140#post1585140

This isn't an original idea, there was a move from RUS Shotguns for a reason.